The Benefits of Being a Sexually Obedient Wife

“I’ve witnessed such an unexpected difference in my husband & I would like to know if you think it’s related to my new attitude regarding sexual obedience. The short story is: my husband has become so ambitious at work (and in life generally). He’s gotten a promotion. But, the biggest change is he’s always wanted to start his own business & he is now taking the steps to do it. He has talked about it for years & dreamed about it, but I’ve never seen an attitude like this. He’s become very alpha. He actually works less now. He’s in a management role & he delegates a lot of work. To hear him on the phone with his employees…it’s like a totally different man. He’s very assertive & authoritative. I must say, it is a turn-on for me & makes me want him more.”

I received this comment from a Christian wife who calls herself Wynter in response to my previous article “How a husband can enjoy sex that is grudgingly given by his wife”.

Over the months since I wrote that article I have been interviewed on a national radio show and have been contacted by people around the world about it. As you would expect I got a lot of hate mail over that article.  But over time I have received several kind emails telling me what an impact it has had in not only helping men to cope with bad situations but also in helping women to see the way they sometimes grudgingly give their husband’s sex through their husbands eyes.

I get people sending me in emails all the time asking “why do you have to talk about sex so much?” and the reason I tell them is because our sexuality whether before marriage or after marriage has such a HUGE impact on our lives even though many Christians don’t want to admit it.  We hear all the time about how we live in an “over-sexed” society and I can see why Christians feel that way because of all the modern imaging technology we have now and how much things that used to be in secret are now in our faces.

But let me assure you – long before the age of electricity and photographs and commercials sex has always played a large part in people’s lives.  The difference was it was hidden. Men and women were frustrated with their sex lives with their spouses since the beginning of mankind. Men and women have both acted sinfully because of wrong choices related to sex.

If we want to keep our young people from sinning sexually and if we want them to truly understand and embrace the gift of sex that God has given to most of his creation we must talk about this.  If we want strong marriages we must talk about this. Wynter’s story illustrates how big of an impact sex when done God’s way in marriage can truly bring new life to that marriage and to an entire family as a result.

Wynter’s Story

“I’ve been taking this seriously for the last six months and I just wanted to tell you & get your comments.

  1. I rarely deny my husband sex of some kind. (I say no sometimes; I’m not perfect). I give oral sex if intercourse is not possible.
  2. I’m SHOCKED at how much my husband wants to have sex. He wants it just about every day, sometimes twice a day. Now that he knows I won’t deny him, he gets into the shower with me often and we make love in there. I had no idea he liked that so much. We did it in the shower a few times when we first got married, but I wasn’t into it because I just wanted to hurry up & shower & get ready for my day.
  3. I’ve witnessed such an unexpected difference in my husband & I would like to know if you think it’s related to my new attitude regarding sexual obedience. The short story is: my husband has become so ambitious at work (and in life generally). He’s gotten a promotion. But, the biggest change is he’s always wanted to start his own business & he is now taking the steps to do it. He has talked about it for years & dreamed about it, but I’ve never seen an attitude like this. He’s become very alpha. He actually works less now. He’s in a management role & he delegates a lot of work. To hear him on the phone with his employees…it’s like a totally different man. He’s very assertive & authoritative. I must say, it is a turn-on for me & makes me want him more.
  4. I will say though that this has not been without sacrifice on my part. I used to work nights, but I changed my schedule to be available to him in the evenings, so I make less money than I used to. I also gave up some activities so I can rest more. A big part of my problem before I started this was I was tired all the time & was too exhausted for sex. But, also, and you’re probably not going to like this: it’s been difficult emotionally because I don’t like giving up control. Honestly, I’ve had to fight my own rebelliousness. Sometimes when he approaches me, I’m tired & lazy & just want him to leave me alone. Sometimes, I’m distracted & don’t want to drop what I’m doing. I don’t know how to put it, but it has been difficult to not have my way on this. That’s been the hardest part. I like being 100% in control of my body & now I have to make sacrifices, so, yes, it’s been difficult. Sexual obedience is a way of life. It requires a whole different mindset. My husband’s needs and fulfillment take up a lot more real estate in my brain now than they used to. It’s not as simple as stop, drop, and “do it” like I thought it was going to be. Am I making any sense?

I’d love to know your thoughts on my story.”

My Response to Wynter

It brings me great joy, God great joy and I am sure your husband great joy to see the change in your attitude toward meeting your husband’s sexual needs.

The “SHOCK” you felt once you opened up and allowed your husband free sexual access to your body is one that many women face when they truly give their husbands that free and unfettered access to their bodies that God demands(I Corinthians 7:3-5).

The way it usually works is like this.  When you are first married in the honeymoon phase of the relationship your husband is all over you if not every day at least several times a week.  But many young brides quickly get over the newness of the sex and feel they must “settle their man down” so when he comes to her she delays him with “not today, maybe tomorrow”.

Her husband then learns that there is a real possibility that every time he goes to initiate his wife may turn him down.   Now most women because of period issues or other medical issues will have to turn their husbands down from time to time and that is ok and husbands need to be understanding about this.

But if you were like most women you probably didn’t realize that if you turn your husband down for sex even for legitimate reasons it is YOUR job to get the sex moving again in your relationship.  Your husband does not want to keep coming and asking for sex hoping this is the night you will say yes.  For many men when their wives turn them down for sex it is like flipping an off switch on your sex life.

It is your job as a wife when you have to turn him down to go and turn the sex switch in your relationship back to ON. Most wives have no clue about this and they simply wait for their husband to initiate again and he may go several days or even a week until he decides to “risk it” again. Some women actually get a sick thrill out of making their husbands never really know if they will say yes or no to them. This is an act of emotional cruelty toward one’s husband.

In either case, when you turn your husband down over time your sex life goes down to one or two times a week eventually or just a few times a month before you know it.

But once you open yourself to your husband and let him know he truly has unfettered access to your body and if you do have to turn him down you do it gently and then as soon as you are ready you initiate to let him know sex is back on the table it will truly revolutionize your marriage as you have seen.

Sex has a huge impact on a man’s demeanor

On the issue of the change in your husband’s ambition and demeanor – Absolutely you giving your body freely and with a good attitude to your husband would definitely help with his ambition and attitude toward life.  Have you have heard the phrase “he just needs to get laid?” I know it sounds crass but it absolutely true.  When a man (or even a woman) feels sexually frustrated or they are not getting sexually feed at home it will affect every part of their life. Often times it will result in men being less ambitious and more irritable.

When a man feels like he can have sex with his wife whenever he wants and he feels like she desires him and he pleases her that same man will often feel like he can go out and conquer the world!

There is an old saying that “behind every great man is a great woman”.  I think that is often true when women truly support their husbands in the way God meant them to.  Forgive me for what I am about to do to that famous phrase but I think this is statement is equally true:

“Underneath every great man is a great a woman”

Think in the sexual arena and let your brain churn for a minute and you will get what I am saying.

Keeping your husband well feed sexually will not only benefit him in his endeavors outside the home but it will also benefit your marriage and your family by giving him the increased energy he needs to take on life’s daily tasks.

Christian Wives must save energy for their sex lives

On the issue of you being tired all the time before – that is absolutely true for many women. The greatest lie of feminism is telling women “You can have it all”.  That is utterly untrue. There are only so many hours in day and you only have so much energy to give.  If you spend 40 hours a week at your job and then another 10 hours a week commuting you are going to have very little energy left to give to your husband, your children and your home.

Many women today save little to no energy for their sex lives with their husbands.  Their jobs get their energy and what little energy they have after going out to their career they give to their children while they husband is left scrounging for scraps of energy from his wife for their sex life.

As you correctly point out – yes it is a sacrifice but I think you would agree based on the changes you have seen in your husband’s life that it was a sacrifice worth making.

I think it is great that you recognize your own rebelliousness and your desire to control your time and your body. At the same time though – don’t beat yourself up.  Recognize your sinful inclinations and then give those things to God.  We all face different types of sins and as men we have our own sinful inclinations as well that we must recognize and fight through God’s grace.

I just want to admonish you to keep up what you have been doing and realize that your sexual obedience is not just to your husband – but truly it is an act of worship to God himself for all he has done for you.  This is also a great testimony that other women can learn from and I want to thank you for sharing this with me and my audience – it is truly a blessing.

As the old song we learned in church goes “Obedience is the very best way to show that you believe”.

“Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ” – II Corinthians 10:5 (KJV)

 

 

148 thoughts on “The Benefits of Being a Sexually Obedient Wife

  1. <–Of course it started at the Fall,

    I wrote this on another blog – still on point for this discussion.

    Way back in Gen 3 we observe that Adam failed to confront the sin of his wife. He obeyed her and not God, Adam broke the first commandment and made pleasing Eve of more importance than pleasing God. He was the first to fall for the “happy wife- happy life” lie and ushered sin and death into the world as a result of his woman worship. Eve committed the sin of covetousness desiring something that was not for her. She desired to as a god, even as Adam feared displeasing her and treated her as a goddess. Elevating the woman is at the heart of the first sin for both males and females.

    These same sins abound today, men who do not want to confront the sins of women and women who covet position and authority that do not belong to them. Women want authority over their bodies, but God does not give them that authority. In the name of that stolen authority women kill the innocent, (while cowardly men support their murders) recklessly fornicate (while horny "alpha" men sow their oars) and defraud their husbands who do have authority over their bodies (while white-knights empower defrauding).

    The clergy are unwilling to call women to repentance for their pervasive sins, but more than willing to make men the scapegoat for women’s sins. Some have blamed Adam for Eve’s sins, because he was not a better leader, all the while venerating the woman as innocent and more spiritual. They make Eve the victim and not an offender, yet God cursed Eve for her sin. In the same manner they blame husbands for the sins of their wives because the husband is not loving enough, not sacrificial enough and has not done enough to have a “happy wife” and therefore deserve a “happy life”. Satan must be laughing with delight at how that original deception is still working to destroy the people of God and how vigorously the church defends the lie.

  2. Jonadab, if this were a blog about the evils of men, you wouldn’t find me anywhere near it as I dislike listening to women whine about men as much as I dislike listening to men whine about women. I honestly don’t think BGR intends for this blog to turn into the evils of women, even though we disagree quite passionately about a good many subjects. There is a huge difference between honestly confronting sin and mere whining about how not everything in life is going your way. Has whining about lack of sex ever resulted in an increased amount of grudging sex much less an actual heart change? I am not blaming you for failing to convert people as that is the Lord’s job and He will do as He sees fit when He sees fit. But the overall amount of sheer bitterness in some comments just destroys the points you try to make (the majority of which I actually agree with).

  3. Jeff, not having sex right after childbirth is hardly a strawman. And if you haven’t gotten by now that I disapprove of sexual denial and advocate for using other methods when the traditional option (for men or women) is unavailable (and even if it isn’t just to spice things up occasionally), than I doubt that you ever will.

    Also you say “They want the male gender to take full responsibility for THEIR decisions and not be held accountable for their decisions.” Who do you mean by ‘they’? Feminists? Women in general (although I highly suspect you view the two as the same)? I get that you feel that some women blame everything on men as a kneejerk reaction to how your wife treats you, but do you realize that you did the EXACT same thing to Michelle earlier when she commented on how her husband sexually denied her and you jumped straight to how it was probably her fault somehow?

  4. AnnaMS,

    “I honestly don’t think BGR intends for this blog to turn into the evils of women, even though we disagree quite passionately about a good many subjects.”

    For the record – no I don’t intend for this blog to ever turn into the a blog about “the evils of women” and I can definitely separate women in general from feminism. I hate feminism as an ideology and believe is patently unbiblical but I do not hate women. Let’s remember that men were the ones that allowed feminism to flourish and turn into what it has turned into over the last century. We are culpable as well.

    Many women are ignorant of what God’s word teaches because they had BOTH a mother and father who NEVER taught them what God’s word teaches on the roles of men and women.

    What I will say though is I agree though with what Jonadab has stated previously that in each era the church has had to confront different kinds of evils. Today I believe the two most destructive philosophies we face as a church are materialism and feminism. We need men to teach their sons and women to teach their daughters what it means to be men and women of God once again. Then we can take back our churches as more families return to God’s ways.

  5. BGR,

    I don’t have a problem with men teaching their sons or women teaching their daughters and I agree with you on the problems of feminism and materialism. But there is a world of difference between the material that you present on this blog (even if I don’t agree with everything you say) and the kind of whining that takes place in the comments section.

    Some people have gotten to the point of frustration with feminism that they have swung to the far opposite end and are filled with bitterness and what seems like real hatred, to the point that a lot of the time they do exactly what they accuse feminists of doing. For all the talk of how feminists want women to not have to take responsibility, we now have this new argument that Adam really wanted to stop Eve he was just scared of offending her. Which makes for a great story but lacks Biblical support.

  6. @AnnaMS

    <–Adam really wanted to stop Eve he was just scared of offending her.

    Yep, Adam failed to correct his wife and instead headed His wife and ate of the forbidden tree. When Adam tells God "The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate." God does not tell Adam to stop blame-shifting or to be a better leader, like modern counselors tell husbands. God instead curses Eve and He also curses Adam, but He counts Adam as the covenant representative for humanity, the first born of creation. Adam heeded his wife and in doing so disobeyed God's law and sin and death entered the world. Men are to always seek the will of God even when it means turning a deaf ear to their wives and making them unhappy. But that is not what is taught in most of Christendom. Adam choose Eve's words over God's, Christ chose to obey His Father and lead His wife, (the church) to repentance in righteousness, even paying the price of her sin with His own death so that she might be justified and made holy. Where Adam failed, Christ succeeded – Adam heeded his wife, Christ rules His wife – Adam sinned, Christ was sinless, Adam brought death, Christ brings life.

    I also believe that you might perhaps be choosing to characterize exhortation, rebuke and admonition as whining as a way to deflect the need for repentance, not just for yourself, but also for the church at large. What you judge to be bitterness, might it be righteous anger at the destruction of the family and the church? How will repentance come to the house of the Lord if the Biblical blueprint for marriage is not clearly contrasted with feminist one? For the man of God, compromise with sin is sin! There is no detente with that which is disobedient to Christ without being disobedient to Christ.

    <—Some people have gotten to the point of frustration with feminism that they have swung to the far opposite end and are filled with bitterness and what seems like real hatred,

    Does God hate sin? Is feminism sin? I answer strongly in the affirmative to both those questions, thus it is Godly to hate feminism, because it a system that supplants God's design for marriage and family. Further feminism is from the world and not of God and as James writes: Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever therefore wants to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God. James 4:4 I think the question is not do I hate sin (feminism) too much, but do I hate it enough.

    <– to the point that a lot of the time they do exactly what they accuse feminists of doing

    What on earth could you mean by such a charge? Supplanting the word of God for autonomy? Turning authority on head? Putting primacy of dominion on the individual over the family? Using sex for leverage over the other in marriage? Fear submission to God and His appointed authorities more than disobedience to God? I really cannot imagine what you are trying to say other than you just don't like the light of God's Word illuminating the extent that the sin of feminism has affected us all.

  7. Anna, I think you may be acting antagonistic here. Jeff’s comment to Michelle is actually correct, I went back and read it, and didn’t see at all how it could be disrespectful. He’s right, many times a husband’s libido will disappear if a wife has been disrespecting him in the years before. His comment looks like it’s trying to offer her information so that maybe her circumstance could clear up. I didn’t see it as blaming her at all, but simply letting her know from a male perspective, what *may* be happening.

    And saying they are full of “bitterness” and “whining” isn’t a good way to interact with these men either. Jonadab has a story that is very painful and consists of the church, many religious men, and his wife all turning against him and being/behaving unbiblical toward his problems with his wife. These men are being sinned against, and so they have a righteous anger that comes across to you as being bitter or whiny, but that stance (calling them that) is not going to help.

  8. Anna,

    Most of the sex problems in marriage are because of the wife. That goes without saying. A strawman is something you say that draws away from the discussion or counter with something that is a ‘no duh’ comment.

    Jumping at Michelles comment was to draw out the point that IF a wife denies for a long time… So again I didn’t have a kneejerk reaction. That women deny their husband far more often and this does lead to distrust is an effect of that. Sorry honey, but you were protecting your gender which is evidence the FI.

  9. And unfortunately, they are very right that most churches never speak about these things (about women being truly submissive wives, respecting their husbands, not denying them sex, and working to become virtuous women. And where does that leave men? Being constantly sinned against, with the people who should be preaching against those sins, too afraid to do it.

    It is a huge problem, and them speaking out about it is very helpful. I already have seen some pastors changing their minds and preaching against feminism and its form that come across in Christian women! Change is happening in some places, but it will not happen if men like these men keep quiet and just try to endure being constantly sinned against. They are standing up for truth and goodness when they speak out about it. I agree with you that sometimes some manosphere men can be too angry or toxic, but I don’t see that here.

  10. “So again I didn’t have a kneejerk reaction. That women deny their husband far more often and this does lead to distrust is an effect of that. ”

    No, it didn’t look like a knee-jerk reaction at all. I’ve seen April tell wives this, and I’ve also told wives the exact same thing you said in a Marriage crisis group I’m a part of on facebook. It’s pretty standard to fishing out what is really happening.

  11. Jonadab,

    You raise a good point about Adam and Eve. My Pastor(whom I am also good friends with) and I recently had a discussion about this.
    I asked him this trick question – “What was Adam’s first sin?” and he looked at me like “duh – eating the forbidden fruit” and I said no God tells us what his first sin was that lead to his second sin:

    “And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;” – Genesis 3:17 (KJV)

    Adams first sin was listening to his wife when he KNEW she was wrong. Then he acted on her request and actually ate the fruit(second sin).

    This is why the Scriptures say:

    “And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.” – I Timothy 2:14 (KJV)

    Adam was not deceived by a lust to have his position raised to be equal with God as Eve was. Adam fell because he listened to his wife when he KNEW she was wrong. This is a powerful lesson to all husbands.

    But even though Adam was not the one deceived, God ultimately held Adam accountable for his failure to rebuke his wife’s sin rather than entering into it with her.

    “Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:” – Romans 5:12 (KJV)

  12. Jonadab,

    One other thing I forgot to mention. Job shows us what Adam should have done when he rebuked his wife’s sinful advice:

    “9 Then said his wife unto him, Dost thou still retain thine integrity? curse God, and die.

    10 But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips.” – Job 2:9-10 (KJV)

    I remember years back when my Pastor was preaching through this chapter in Job and he came to these verses he jokingly said “husbands if you are going to talk to your wife the way Job did here you better back way up”. But seriously this is EXACTLY how Adam should have handled Eve’s sinful request to him. Men need to grow spines and discipline their wives as Job did.

  13. Pointing out that it’s permissible to turn down certain types of sex for medical reasons isn’t distracting from a discussion that is literally about when (if ever) it’s okay to turn down sex. It also wasn’t a straw man for Anna to point out that medical reasons were legitimate reasons to turn down sec when Jonadab kept insisting (without clarifying until I asked him directly) that husbands and wives should only abstain from sex for prayer and fasting.

    It was, however, a pretty big mischaracterization of our arguments when you scolded us for not considering alternatives to vaginal sex postpartum when we had both just agreed with Jonadab that wives should satisfy their husbands in other ways postpartum. I’d give you the benefit of the doubt and say that maybe you didn’t see those comments before posting, but I can’t because you seem to have read my comment where I asked Jonadab to clarify his position. You claimed that I was bringing up a straw man and not considering alternatives when I had said, in that comment, that wives should be open to giving blowjobs postpartum. You also accused Anna and me of denying our husbands for days at a time when we’d both repeatedly clarified our position on sexual denial and when I’d already clarified that I’ve never once turned my husband down in three years of marriage. So, yeah, you are having knee jerk reactions in this thread. You’re not reading the words that people are typing and responding to them. You’re responding to a few phrases that set off knee jerk reactions and ignoring the rest.

  14. Jonadab, I don’t doubt that Adam’s sin was in following Eve’s direction rather than God’s. I just don’t see Biblical support for him doing it out of fear rather than out of support for her. There is also a massive difference between hating the sin and hating the sinner. I definitely hate what feminism has become (and can see the effects of it in my church and in my family) but hating at people is not going to help. I am definitely not trying to silence what you or other men bring to this discussion as highlighting truth is important and quite frankly i have absolutely no desire to fight feminism by myself.

    Dragonfly, I am not trying to be antagonistic here. It is very frustrating to me when I deal with women at work (and other places, but mainly at work) and I am trying to show them the love that Christ, the church, and Christian men have for them (Jonadab and Jeff are not the only ones with a sad history) and I have to deal with stupid stuff men like them have said before I can even get to making my main point. I realize that the church has long since stopped speaking truth on this issue to the extent that it isn’t a safe place for men anymore. But when my unsaved sister looks over my shoulder and sees a comment Jeff wrote and I have to convince her that ‘not all Christian men are like that’ before I can even get the conversation back about Jesus, that is a serious problem. I realize that these men have legitimate hurts, but sometimes we need to not let them get in the way of how we deal with the unsaved world. I have been sexually abused by one man, attempted kidnapped by two more, saw a fourth fake Christianity in order to marry my sister only to turn around and become an alcoholic, and saw a fifth hide his mental issues from another sister and then spiral down into tantrums after they married (complete with slamming doors and lying on the floor kicking and screaming…not to mention trying to hit her with kitchen utensils). And that’s just in my immediate family. If I were to take a bitter hatred of men away from that, not only would that be sin, but I’d also have missed the wonderful marriage I have with my husband and would instead have become a stumbling block for non-Christian men who see my bitterness and want nothing to do with my Savior.

    I loathe feminism as much as anyone else on this blog. But just fighting feminism isn’t the answer. We need to seek to replace it with God’s truth. The way God designed for relationships to work and for men and women to relate to each other is very appealing. And yes, it bothers me when the way people talk hides the appealing nature of that truth.

  15. Jeff,Jonadab,Anna and Alex,

    I am going to try and be the peacemaker here.

    I think anyone who were to read our comments would know that we all see problems with feminism.
    Jeff, Jonadab and I believe that the entire ideology of feminism is bad and wrong for our culture, our churches and our families to the point where we would agree that woman’s suffrage opened the doorway to a lot of the mess we find ourselves in today. I don’t remember if DragonFly would go that far against feminism as believing allowing women’s suffrage was wrong.

    But if I remember correctly from past comments from Alex and Anna they believe feminism’s original intents were noble but it eventually got perverted(as in second wave feminism) but Anna and Alex both fully embrace the idea of male headship and submission. We may apply some things differently and we definitely have some differences on things like discipline of wives by their husbands.

    I think it is good to discuss our differences even though we are all opponents of feminism even if we are to greater and lesser extents.

    But I think we need to try really hard not to mischaracterize where the other person comes from.

    I know from many many comments that both Alex and Anna have made that they believe while husbands should give their wives’ reprieve from vaginal intercourse for medical reasons they also believe at the same time they can take care of their of their husbands using other means in most cases during this time. They are not looking for “an out” but simply offering an alternative.

    I know that both Jeff and Jonadab were not saying that women must have vaginal sex even when it is medically bad to do so, they were just saying women should not use that as an excuse to no try ANY means of helping their husbands – something all of us here agree on.

    I also realize that we all have our sad stories. I have suffered a lot at the hands of women and if I were not a Christian could have allowed myself to become very embittered at the female sex just as Anna could have allowed herself to become embittered at the male sex.

    I think Jonadab and Jeff have a visceral hatred for feminism as opposed to women in general as I have seen them both compliment women who want to follow God’s ways in their marriages and in life. We may express our hatred for feminism in different ways.

    Well there you have it – my attempt to make some peace and show some common ground.

  16. Thanks, BGR. Sorry for getting testy and going on the defensive. Jonadab, sorry for misunderstanding you. Jeff, I understand where you’re trying to give advice.

  17. <– I just don’t see Biblical support for him doing it out of fear rather than out of support for her

    I see that as a distinction without a difference. One could just as easily rephrase it Adam acted out of a fear of lack of support for Eve. The crux of the matter is Adam didn't fear God enough, but supplanted that fear with something toward Eve. You may be uncomfortable with the word fear, but I see it as the most logical expression for his motivation. Even to suggest that Adam acted out of love to Eve is misguided, for his love for Eve would have been best expressed by protecting her and admonishing away from her covetousness. But he did not. The text makes it clear – Adam heeded his wife and not God. His acquiesce demonstrated that the fear of broken fellowship with Eve eclipsed his fear of broken fellowship with God.

    Yes, men fear disappointing their wives, they fear disunity and they fear her disapproval. (When a wife refuses sex the pain of rejection can affect him to his core) If only women knew the true power they posses they might understand that in weakness they are strong, and by submission they find strength. Men too, have failed to trust that the fear of God will bring the greatest blessings. Like Adam we have given in to the lie "happy wife- happy life" and failed to sanctify our brides by the Word of God for fear of "unhappy wife – unhappy life". As fish does not know that he is wet and does not know what dry is, modern man does not know God's design for marriage is because they swim in a sea of feminism which has affected us all.

  18. @ all

    Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. He who calls you is faithful, who also will do it. … The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you. Amen.

    1 Thessalonians 5:23 & 28

  19. Alex,

    Your solipsism is amusing. Can I ask you a question that was raised in the media? If abortion is illegal and a woman gets an abortion, should she be punished according to the law that abortion is murder? In other words, she has committed murder. Remember we live in the 21st century and we are talking about the USA. We all know that a fetus is an innocent human. All American women know it’s a Being forming in the womb. Should she be held to murder?

    Dragonfly’s comment is correct and liberal pastors will rail against feminism. Look deeply into the Female Imperative and tell me pastors do not full embrace the Female Imperative. Alex and Anna are so steeped in the Female Imperative they defend the “sisterhood” or females at the cost of men who are honorable and virtuous while telling us they do not.

  20. @Jonadab 11:56

    Outstandingly said. My wife and I went to counseling with a very, very well known pastor who is on national radio. I said this to him and he could not see it. The only thing he saw was that God put man in charge of all including his helpmeet Eve and therefore was responsible for her. He could actually say that, but if I correct my helpmeet than all of a sudden I am breaking 1 P 3:7 and Eph 5:24. Go figure. All the responsibility without authority and the ability to discipline is laughable.

  21. @Jeff,

    Yes, abortion should be punished as murder. This would include some who abort their children, doctors who perform those abortions, and men who trick their girlfriends into taking abortion pills. Talk about a straw man.

    Also, I’m hardly defending women who sexually deny their husbands. If you think that giving women who struggle with fulfilling their husbands’ sexual needs advice on how they can do better is defending them, then that’s your own damage talking. If you think that encouraging women to appreciate what their husbands do for them is defending women who don’t appreciate their husbands, then I can’t help you. I also don’t think that Anna, who put in hard work and effort and endured pain in order to overcome her vaginismus so that she and her husband could fully consummate their marriage, is defending women who sexually deny their husbands.

    But what exactly do you have a problem with here? The fact that I said that women should be open to giving oral? The fact that I said that I don’t deny my husband and make consistent efforts to please him inside and outside of the bedroom?

  22. Jeff,

    “Alex and Anna are so steeped in the Female Imperative they defend the “sisterhood” or females at the cost of men who are honorable and virtuous while telling us they do not.”

    I am a bit perplexed at your statement. What sinful activity of feminism are Alex and Anna defending? Can you give an example?

  23. Jonadab, I think I had a different understanding of the word ‘fear’ than you did when we were talking about Adam and Eve. Based on your last post, I don’t see anything major I disagree with.

    Jeff, whatever floats your boat, man. Sure, I defend the ‘sisterhood’ against honorable men. Tell that to my husband who had to all but pull me off the feminist in our church care group when she got mad at him about something stupid (which ended up being entirely her fault…shocker). Or when I corrected our care group leader for falling for the ‘happy wife happy life’ lie when he told my husband to be careful to keep me happy so I’d take him back home with me (still have no idea where that even came from). Or when I corrected my sister on facebook for posting something about moms where the thinly veiled message was really that dads were stupid and moms were needed to save the day. I see feminism in all 3 of these instances. But if you see me and other women like me in those scenarios as well, that really seems like anyone who happens to have a second X chromosome instead of a Y is naturally part of the problem. And that would seem to lead to a rather miserable life.

  24. @AnnaMS,

    “Or when I corrected my sister on facebook for posting something about moms where the thinly veiled message was really that dads were stupid and moms were needed to save the day.”

    Oh! I’ve this attitude a lot, ESPECIALLY towards dads who work long hours outside the home while their wives are either stay-at-home moms or work part-time jobs while focusing most of their time on the kids, who are in school, and on home-care. I think that it comes down to a fundamental misunderstanding of what the mother’s role is and what the father’s role is. One of the father’s main duties is to provide for his children, and he needs to go out and make money in order to do that. There might be some men fail to lead their wives or their children because they schedule themselves enough time to do this (and I’m not talking about him sitting down and just talking to them here–I’m talking about them making sure that everything is being run properly at home and that the kids are doing well in school, behaving properly, and receiving proper spiritual instruction), but I don’t think that that’s what those posters are talking about. I think that they believe that the mother and father in those families should be spending equal time with their kids, which doesn’t make sense if the father has taken on the role of provider while the mother has taken on the role of home-keeper and nurturer.

  25. Alex, that is a very common problem! The one I was referencing was more about how single moms do all the work while the other parent is a deadbeat dad. Which is exactly the situation my sister finds herself in. But it’s a huge mistake to generalize that to all moms and dads, and it’s very disrespectful to the men out there who are fabulous fathers. I realize she has serious issues with her ex and I sympathize with that, but that would be much better handled with a private phone call rather than lashing out at men in general.

  26. @alex re: jeff

    “But what exactly do you have a problem with here? The fact that I said that women should be open to giving oral?”

    The title of this post comes into play here. There are “benefits” to both the husband and the wife with oral sex. Usually, the husband that is more sexually satisfied is going to be more appreciative to his wife. Any husband who says he does not want or does not enjoy receiving oral sex is very likely lying. I have to qualify that statement with “very likely” as there may be a few men who really do not want it. But, these men are rare, and one wonders if their denials are due to fear of the Female Imperative at play in their marriage.

    There has been some discussion of denying sex after childbirth or during menstruation. This is another advantage of oral sex. A husband can be sexually satisfied (through oral) when it is difficult, painful or inconvenient for the wife to have vaginal intercourse.

    I am not a marriage blogger, but have written a few essays on oral sex. What makes me wonder is: why in the 21st century are there wives who will not give oral sex to their husbands? This reluctance on the part of some wives is due to needless mental inhibitions that need to be discarded.

  27. Alex and Anna,

    ““Or when I corrected my sister on facebook for posting something about moms where the thinly veiled message was really that dads were stupid and moms were needed to save the day.”

    Oh! I’ve this attitude a lot, ESPECIALLY towards dads who work long hours outside the home while their wives are either stay-at-home moms or work part-time jobs while focusing most of their time on the kids, who are in school, and on home-care. I think that it comes down to a fundamental misunderstanding of what the mother’s role is and what the father’s role is.”

    Just to piggy back on what you both have said with the different roles of mothers and fathers. I read a Christian marriage book a few years ago that basically said that men need to concentrate less on their activities outside the home and take a queue from their wives and spend more time with the children. On the surface that advice seems good if we are thinking of Dads that spend no time with their wives and children and spend all their time outside the home with work or hobbies.

    But this is not what he was talking about. He was going far beyond that talking condemning men spending so much time in their careers work outside the home. As you said the roles of mothers and fathers are VERY different. This author was saying things like “it is wrong that dads don’t always know all the personal details about their children that the mother does. For instance mom’s often know the clothing sizes and styles that each of their children like as well as each child’s favorite foods and foods that they do not like. Mom’s often have a much better gage of a child’s emotional state and emotional issues they may be dealing with and often father’s are clueless in all these areas and more”

    That is pretty close to what he said. While I agree that we as fathers need to know our children mothers often know some of these details much more than fathers do and especially in the emotional area God created women to understand people’s emotions and be much more perceptive than men typically are. This is strength that women have and something fathers should be able to depend on mothers to help them with. This is why moms and dads need to talk about these things. But it does not mean a father must spend equal time with his children to the mother or in essence become exactly like the mom. God made men and women different for their distinct roles that they play.

    I believe a husband is not only called to provide but he is called make his mark on the world outside his home to the best of his ability while at the same time spending time with his wife and children and teaching the Word of God.

    So as I have said here many times a man’s service in leading, teaching, providing for and protecting his wife and his children are a part of his mission from God but it is only part of his mission. He is also called to go out into the world and work not only to provide but to make his mark. Whether that is to be the best auto mechanic, plumber, electrician, doctor, lawyer, pastor or whatever else he can be. So he is called to this along with his duties to his family. If he fails at EITHER then he has failed his mission.

    However a woman’s husband, her children and her home are not just part of her mission – but they ARE her mission. If a woman does not have big foot print outside her home but she serves her husband, her children and her home well then she has succeeded in her primary mission.

  28. Larryzb, I think there are lots of reasons why some women dislike giving oral sex, some of which are more valid than others (although obviously getting over all of the reasons to the point of being able to give oral sex is definitely the goal). While not meant to be an all-inclusive list, some dislike the submission aspect of it, some don’t think it’s fair that the husband gets pleasure where the wife does not (although a cheerful wife will likely get a good deal of pleasure knowing she is pleasing her husband), some view oral sex as “dirty” d/t how they were raised, and some actually do have a mental block with it. I’m in the latter category. I don’t know why I have a hang up although I suspect it’s partially related to sexual abuse as well as being a nurse and seeing a lot of gross genitals on a fairly regular basis.

    I think whatever the reason, wives should work on getting over their issues and confessing sin where necessary (as the first two reasons above will involve). I know I’ve made some progress in this area although there is a lot more to be made unfortunately. I’m very thankful for my wonderful husband who appreciates and praises my efforts, while being honest about his desires.

  29. “I am a bit perplexed at your statement. What sinful activity of feminism are Alex and Anna defending? Can you give an example?”

    @BGR, I think they are reacting to the attitude… calling him bitter and accusing them of whining… it just doesn’t work and is condescending, and is a feminist attitude. I’ve done it before too, so I know what it looks like, and that it’s giving in to getting angry and then attacking them – just like femininists often do to men when they are not even angry (like Jonadab) but simply pointing out all these issues. When women trying to argue with them, and then go into attack mode on how they “sound,” men don’t typically respond well in kind. It’s not feminine behavior, and it’s disrespectful to them.

    Anna, I don’t want to come across as yucky or condescending, but I don’t think it’s your job to scold them into not talking certain ways. You’re not their boss, even a wife shouldn’t scold her husband like that, because it’s disrespectful. I’ll say it again, calling them bitter and whiny isn’t going to help because it’s offensive.

    I just talked to a woman recently that was in victim mode about her husband not being intimate with her – she was very whiny and complaining… I found out from her that he’s in extreme horrific pain and dying of cancer. It took everything in me to not get angry that she was being so selfish, only focusing on her “need for sex” and that it was “so hard.” But I HAD to approach her with extreme gentleness and just remind her of her duty to “do him good and not evil, all the days of her life.” She didn’t like it at first because I guess I let on that I was trying to get her to focus on her duty to her husband, but then I gave her an example of an amazing Christian woman in the past that successfully was a solid rock and encouragement to her dying husband (for 6 years). This was the only way to help her… not getting angry and shaming/scolding her for being a brat… she would have never listened to me and would have gotten offended, and then felt “even more” like a victim for me “attacking her.”

    You need to be careful how you respond to people in pain or when they’re being sinned against. Some people (like these guys) have a REAL reason to be righteously angry.

  30. You raise another good point about why men pouring a lot of time and energy into their work is not only acceptable but biblical. I was thinking primarily in tense of why that makes him a good dad and husband rather than a bad one, but you’re also right in that it can allow him to have a positive impact on the world as a whole.

    And of course there’s nothing wrong with men making time in their schedules for hobbies and friends. Women whose children are in school are often able to schedule those things in for themselves in between cooking and cleaning for the day, and men should certainly take time to do the same, especially since a hobby or a friendship could also help them fulfill their mission.

  31. I should have added, I let her know in polite ways that if she was pressuring her husband for sex when he was in extreme pain from cancer, that yes, he might respond with being distant and cold or even angry. She did not want to hear this. She only wanted to focus on how long it had been, etc.

    And I should have added…. the story about the Christian woman who successfully helped her husband until his time to depart, that actually did help her renew her strength and mind to continue being a good wife. So I could have chosen a way of scolding and shaming her (which would not have worked because its not giving her respect), or I could use other tactics while still caring about her. The weird thing… my attitude changed toward her as I chose to see her as a real person who really was in pain and in a hard situation. Giving her validation as a human being changed my heart toward her, and that’s probably what made it the most successful to get her to continue on in her journey.

  32. @Dragonfly,

    I get why Jonadab and Jeff at angry. (Particularly Jonadab. I remember the post about his experiences on here, and I know that he’s had a rough go.) I agree with Anna that it’s ultimately best to let that go if you can, but I also see your point. It’s not helpful to approach someone who’s hurting (justifiably so) with some unkind words.

    However, while Jeff may have the right to be upset about certain words, he is wrong to willfully misrepresent someone’s position on certain issues and continue to insist that they’re lying about their real beliefs.

  33. AnnaMS,

    “While not meant to be an all-inclusive list, some dislike the submission aspect of it, some don’t think it’s fair that the husband gets pleasure where the wife does not (although a cheerful wife will likely get a good deal of pleasure knowing she is pleasing her husband)”

    In my experience I have seen this submission and “why should he get pleasure when I am not” aspect being a big part of why some Christian wives will not give oral or even manual help to their husbands when vaginal sex is not available. They basically have the attitude “If I can’t have pleasure then you can’t have pleasure” – which is an UTTERLY selfish view and contrary to the role God meant for wives to play in serving their husbands various needs.

    I can understand more the women in your situation that faced abuse and may have mental blocks due to issues like this and it is not coming from a position of selfishness. But I am also glad you are trying and working at this and that your husband is also being honest with you about his desires while at the same time being patient.

  34. “However, while Jeff may have the right to be upset about certain words, he is wrong to willfully misrepresent someone’s position on certain issues and continue to insist that they’re lying about their real beliefs.”

    I think reacting with goodness, instead of with accusing them of being bitter or whiny (which is what feminists immediately go to), is what we’re called to do. I get it and know it’s hard when talking with men online. Cane Caldo has called me a whore, slut, bitch, and written many many comments slandering me around the manosphere for months. The only way to respond back was with calculated ignoring him (not reading his comments anymore) and goodness. Getting into it with men who are acting in sin isn’t what God wants us to do, even online.

  35. @Dragonfly,

    Well, I’m happy that that worked. I’m also happy that you were able to help out that woman whose husband was dying of cancer.

  36. As to the submission aspect of giving oral sex being a hurdle for wives to get over, a wife is being submissive during oral but she is not being passive during the act. She is being active and has much control so to speak over her husband’s pleasure. But these mental hangups can be overcome. As many experienced wives will tell you, once they overcame their mental hangups and their fears, oral sex became a beautifully intimate experience for both them and their husband. In fact, I have seen several comments on various marriage blogs from wives who admit they did not give oral for many years (in some cases, more than 20 years), and when they finally tired it and kept at it they say they found it to be “no big deal” and began to enjoy it. One sees remarks to the effect that they wish they had given oral sex a fair try many years earlier. This is food for thought for the wives who are clinging to their feelings of being degraded by giving oral. How is the wife degraded in a loving marriage when she gives oral? This feminist claptrap thinking is ubiquitous and must be exposed and discarded.

  37. DragonFly,

    I understand now what you are saying about attitudes and approaches to hurting people. I agree.
    I do think that AnnaMS and Alex did have a right to defend their positions from being mischaracterized, but perhaps they could have done so without the adjectives they chose to use.

  38. DragonFly,

    Not to sound like I am talking out of two sides of my mouth – but I can also see the value in not always having to defend ones self. We just have to judge each situation as to what we should do.

  39. @larryzb,

    Lol. You do raise yet another excellent point. I think that oral sex is often portrayed in a way that overshadows the power and control that it gives the giver. On the one hand, it puts the giver in a sacrificial position because they are giving physical pleasure without receiving any. On the other hand, they’re completely in control of the other person’s pleasure. It is a submissive act in some ways, but it’s not a passive act, and it’s not one that has to be or feel degrading.

    Also, it can be reciprocated. I understand if some women are more reluctant to give oral if their husbands never return the favor, but I don’t think that it’s right to make the act of giving into a tit-for-tat procedure.

  40. Dragonfly, I get what you’re saying and I appreciate your desire to help men who have been grossly mistreated by feminism. I am not trying to scold them into a different mode of behavior nor do I think I would be particularly successful at that.

    However, there is a point where truth is truth. I am not the only person on this blog who finds them (particularly Jeff) to be extremely bitter to the point of sin. And I have had to redirect people like my sister away from that and try to point them back to Christ (with only partial success). There are real-world impacts to how we talk and the words we say and pointing that out for them to either take or leave should not be a problem. God will not excuse their behavior because they have been hurt anymore than He would excuse bitterness in me as a result of my experiences (although as you chose to completely ignore the examples I gave, I kinda feel your online radar is only for men who have been hurt so I’m not sure if pain other people suffer even matters to you).

    This is something that has bothered me for awhile, but when a post that was originally about how a Christian woman changed her behavior so that she was a blessing to her husband, and it STILL devolved into the evils of women, I felt it was worth saying something. I’m not sure it will do any real good, but to the extent that they are at least aware that the way they are communicating is a real stumbling block to some non-Christians, that is a good thing.

    It is a mistake to assume that if feminists accuse someone of whining, than all people who do that are acting like feminists. For one thing, feminists also breathe……………..

  41. @ Alex:
    APRIL 28, 2016 AT 3:51 PM

    Thank you for your comment. It flushed out the insightful details better than I could.

    @ AnnaMS:
    APRIL 28, 2016 AT 4:03 PM

    I quite agree that how some comments are made can be even more important than what is actually conveyed in the comments. Although the “what” has been problematic for some. Many men are hurting badly in their marriages. But, comments can be kept civil, objective and dispassionate (as much as possible).

    A man hopes to find a refuge in his marriage from the pressures of today’s messed up world. He wants his wife to love and emotionally support him. When the home is a battleground, the husband feels rejected and this hurts. In our society (in the US), we always consider that women feel emotional pain and rarely consider that men do as well. Men are not robots. This is a major problem in our society. We think less of men if they show emotion. And, that is bull crap. (If I shed tears at a funeral of a loved one, does that make me less of a man? I think not.)

    On a side note, are the rest of you aware of how this blog is being ripped and slandered elsewhere on the Internet? I have checked some of this out and what I find gives credence to those who talk about the Female Imperative being embedded in Christianity today.

  42. Larryzb,

    “On a side note, are the rest of you aware of how this blog is being ripped and slandered elsewhere on the Internet? I have checked some of this out and what I find gives credence to those who talk about the Female Imperative being embedded in Christianity today.”

    I am very aware of this and actually routinely google my blog to see who is referencing it. In fact I sometimes purposefully title my blog posts in more provocative manners to get people thinking and discussing certain topics.

    But you know what they say “there is no such thing as bad publicity”. I can’t tell you how many Christians(and even some non-Christians) have read horrible slanderous reviews of my various articles on my blog and they come to my blog in many cases angry. But then they read what I write in its entirety and they read other articles I have written that give a my fuller view based on larger picture of things in the Scriptures and I have seen many people actually changed because of it.

    And really it is not me doing the changing – God’s Word does all the changing. We just need to lead people to God’s Word.

  43. @larryzb,

    “A man hopes to find a refuge in his marriage from the pressures of today’s messed up world. He wants his wife to love and emotionally support him. When the home is a battleground, the husband feels rejected and this hurts. In our society (in the US), we always consider that women feel emotional pain and rarely consider that men do as well. Men are not robots. This is a major problem in our society. We think less of men if they show emotion. And, that is bull crap. (If I shed tears at a funeral of a loved one, does that make me less of a man? I think not.)”

    Yeah, I think that there is a general problem where men are either encouraged to show all of their emotions even they’d rather handle them privately or they’re judged for showing emotion at all. I’m of the opinion that a wife should never judge her husband for showing emotional vulnerability. She shouldn’t force him to talk about his feelings if that’s not what he wants to do, but she also should tell him and show him that she’ll be there for him, loving and non-judgmental, if he needs to be vulnerable. She shouldn’t try to make him act like a woman, but she also shouldn’t make him feel as though he constantly has to perform in a certain way to gain her approval.

  44. Larryzb, you make an excellent point about how men need to be able to show emotional pain as well without being belittled or having it seen as weird. That is a trap I fell into early on in my relationship with my husband (prior to marriage). For some reason I saw him as emotionally impenetrable and was completely blind to how some things I said or did effected him. I’m really not sure how that happened because my own dad was not one to never show his emotions, and I had nothing but respect for that.

    I don’t think I can fully understand the reaction this blog gets with other people cuz i don’t see the hatemail that BGR gets and I don’t do any side research of my own, but I definitely see the effects of feminism in the church (and unfortunately in my own care group). And my church makes a huge emphasis on male leadership, so I can only imagine how much worse it is at other churches.

  45. Dragonfly, just a follow-up that the advice you recommend to me of responding in goodness is exactly what I am recommending to them. I am not denying that they have hurt, but pointing out that how we respond is important. I can also appreciate what you mention about ignoring sin in other people (to a point), but that is the exact opposite of what Jonadab was recommending, so please at least recognize that that is misplaced defense if that is your strategy.

    There are male spaces on the internet where men can go to share their grievances. While other women may seek to infiltrate it (as I believe you have at times), I intentionally stay away so that they have that space and because I don’t have anything to add to that conversation. I stay away from extreme feminist blogs for the exact same reason. This is not one of those blogs, and they should not expect the same sheltering as a result.

  46. “I am not trying to scold them into a different mode of behavior nor do I think I would be particularly successful at that.”

    Yes, but you actually did, I definitely could see it in the words you chose, almost mocking their pain. That would make them angry, or at the very least, feel like you’re not understanding them.

    “I am not the only person on this blog who finds them (particularly Jeff) to be extremely bitter to the point of sin. And I have had to redirect people like my sister away from that and try to point them back to Christ (with only partial success).”

    It’s just my opinion that it’s definitely not your job to go around pointing out men’s sins. You’re not his authority or any relationship to him, even a wife would have to be extremely respectful in trying to confront a husband’s sin. You weren’t respectful at all. But again, I don’t think it’s your place. If anything, it would need to come from another man.

    “There are real-world impacts to how we talk and the words we say and pointing that out for them to either take or leave should not be a problem. God will not excuse their behavior because they have been hurt anymore than He would excuse bitterness in me as a result of my experiences (although as you chose to completely ignore the examples I gave, I kinda feel your online radar is only for men who have been hurt so I’m not sure if pain other people suffer even matters to you).”

    Do you kind of see the mental gymnastics you’re doing here? You say God will not excuse their behavior, and yet YOU are trying to get them to change by yourself. God will deal with people, I’ve found out that for sure, and He is a much harsher judge sometimes with what he will punish men with than we would normally decide for them ourselves. He’s called the “Avenger,” in Isaiah, the God of Vengeance also. So you’re not supposed to take any man’s sin into your own hands (especially one on the internet) and try to get them to change. At least, not in that way. Even a wife is supposed to “win him over without a word.”

    I’m not ignoring your examples about your life, I’m telling you from another woman that’s made your mistake, that this is not how it’s done. For either men or women in pain, it’s not how you go about it.

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