Real men DO provide and Real women DO appreciate it

“Real men provide Real women appreciate it” was a simple message posted on a billboard in Forysth County, North Carolina.  60 years ago such a sign would have been lauded by our communities.  But now in our post-feminist culture this message is considered “a sexist comment”.

Molly Grace, a woman who organized opposition to the sign, made this statement:

“The very notion that there should be a man to provide and that no matter what a woman should just plain accept it and appreciate it, is a sexist comment,” said Grace, who is an outspoken critic against the billboard.”

http://myfox8.com/2017/02/28/crowdfunding-to-change-controversial-billboard-in-winston-salem/

She wants the anonymous person who paid for it to be posted to come to a local panel and “explain why they think the way that they do and try to shed some light on it for us”.

Some people thought the anonymous person who posted the sign was targeting men, not women.

“Donald Amos says he likes the sign and said he believes it’s directed toward men who are not fulfilling their promises.

“A lot of times, women have to go on their own and do this and take the role of a man and a women and it’s not right, but it happens and I think men ought to step their game up. Really they ought to and become men again instead of shoulda, coulda, wannabes,” Amos said.”

http://myfox8.com/2017/02/22/real-men-provide-billboard-in-forsyth-county-sparks-controversy/

Perhaps it would have been considered less “sexist” to feminists if the sign had simply read “Real men provide”.  But because the sign implied that real women appreciate men that can provide for them – that cannot be allowed to stand.

Why do some people think that real men should provide and real women should appreciate it?

If you are a person that thinks like Molly let me “shed some light” on this issue for you from the source that some Americans still hold dear and that is the Bible.

The man’s providing role is referenced in multiple passages of the Scriptures.

In Genesis after Adam and Eve sinned God said he would make both Adam and Eve’s primary roles more difficult:

“16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;

19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.”

Genesis 3:16-19 (KJV)

Woman would experience great pain now in child birth – one of her most important duties in her help meet role to man. It would not so easy for man to provide for his family, but instead he would have to work hard to get what he needed from the earth.

In addition because of woman’s new sinful nature she would make his other very important role, that of leading the home, much more difficult as she would seek to control him and the home instead of submitting to him as God had designed her to do.

But even though God made the man’s duty of providing and the woman’s duty to give birth more difficult he also provide them both with the gift of joy from the pain they had to endure in their labor:

“A woman when she is in travail hath sorrow, because her hour is come: but as soon as she is delivered of the child, she remembereth no more the anguish, for joy that a man is born into the world.”

John 16:21 (KJV)

“There is nothing better for a man, than that he should eat and drink, and that he should make his soul enjoy good in his labour. This also I saw, that it was from the hand of God.”

Ecclesiastes 2:24 (KJV)

In the Law of Moses a man’s provision for his wife was deemed of such critical importance that if he failed to do so his wife could seek a divorce:

“10 If he take him another wife; her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish. 11 And if he do not these three unto her, then shall she go out free without money.”

Exodus 21:10-11 (KJV)

The New Testament reaffirms and strengthens the distinct roles of man and woman

The New Testament tells us that a woman’s primary role is to be the bearer of children and the keeper of the home:

 “4 That they may teach the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children, 5 To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.”

Titus 2:4-5 (KJV)

God reiterates his call for men to be providers and protectors to their wives in the Epistle to the Ephesians:

“28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:”

Ephesians 5:28-19 (KJV)

Husbands are called by God to provide for the physical needs of their wife as they would the needs of their own body.  They are also called to protect their wife as they would their own body.

Was the Proverbs 31 woman a career woman?

Many Christians have tried to point to Proverbs 31 to show a defense of women having careers outside the home.  There is no doubt that Proverbs 31 shows the woman going out to plant a field or sell in the market.  But here is what people miss.

The Proverbs 31 wife did not leave anything undone in her home so as to go outside the home and provide.  It tells us of her husband “The heart of her husband doth safely trust in her…” (vs 11) and that she “She looketh well to the ways of her household…”(vs 27).

Proverbs 31 in no way paints the modern career women we see today.  With the schedules that modern career women keep being gone from their home anywhere from 40 to sometimes 50 hours a week there is little to no chance they are also doing 100% of what they should be doing at home.  Their duties to their home will slide or be neglected.

But can’t a woman and her husband just split the roles of provider and the duties of the home?

Well if we want to throw out the duties God has assigned to man and woman as well as then entire picture of marriage with man symbolizing God as the leader, PROVIDER and protector of the woman and woman submitting to her husband and serving him by bearing his children, caring for them and caring for the home then sure – it does not matter and husband and wives can split these roles.

But what if the man can’t work?

Because we live in sin cursed world husbands get sick, get disabled or lose their jobs. Sometimes because we live in sin cursed world unforeseen financial events occur where a man must ask his wife to work to provide additional income for their family to survive.  These are not the kinds of situations we are talking about in this article.  God understands this type of situation.

But what we are talking about here are young couples that marry and PLAN to have the wife be a career woman. We are talking about a man and woman literally agreeing to the fact that she will purposefully not devote herself entirely to her duties to bear children, care for them and care for the home.

These couples actually PLAN to split the duties of husbands and wives between themselves in direct contradiction to God’s design and his commands. There is no excuse for such plans of men and women which go against the very commands of God.

Real men provide

If you are a young man reading this I hope that it will help to show you that our culture has sinned against God in abandoning the gender roles he designed. I hope that you will purpose in your heart that you will not seek marriage to any woman until you can provide for her so that she can dedicate herself fully to the role God has given her as the bearer and nurturer of your future children and the keeper of your future home.

I am not saying you have to be rich when you get married.  Please don’t misunderstand me.  But you should be able to provide a modest life – with food and shelter. You don’t have to provide brand new cars and a big fancy house.  If you can provide for her the basics of life so she can be the homemaker God wants her to be then you are doing what is right before God.

As a young man you should have a plan to further yourself anticipating that as your family grows so too the expenses will grow.  This means that while you may be able to marry based on a certain wage you make – you need to plan on how you will provide more in the future as your family needs it.

And in the future should you ever lose your job – asking your wife to work outside the home should be your last resort. If you have to work two jobs to provide –then you should do so.

Real women appreciate a man who will provide for them

If you are one of these young women that were raised by your parents to be independent and not have to depend on a man you need to throw that thinking out in the trash. Your parents may have felt they were doing right by you and just looking out for you in case you don’t find a husband or in case your husband were to divorce you or die.

Yes because of sin in this world we are not always able to live up to God’s design for men, women and marriage. But we should not plan for the failure of God’s plan in marriage due to sin on our part or that of our spouse or the sinful circumstances of this world.

Instead we should plan for success.

As a young lady your goal should be this very goal given to you directly by God through the Apostle Paul:

“I will therefore that the younger women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully.”

1 Timothy 5:14 (KJV)

Will you follow the world’s pattern or God’s pattern?

To young men and women.  You must decide before you seek out marriage.  Will you follow the world’s pattern of partnership marriage and gender neutrality when it comes to the roles in your family or will you follow the pattern God has established for men and women?

The Bible tells us not to follow our culture when it conflicts with God’s design:

 “And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.”

Romans 12:2 (KJV)

Will you ask God to renew your mind today? To make you the man or woman he has called you to be? To play the role he has called you to? I hope that you will.

And let me tell you something – it will bring peace to your marriage if you follow God’s pattern especially in this area of the man being the provider for the home.

You see God has placed a desire in every man to provide for his woman and his family.  For some men it is buried far beneath years of conditioning by our culture, but make no mistake it is there.  That is why many men cannot marry a woman who makes more than them.  It is not a pride issue, it is a God given man issue.

Its time to blunt about this

Sinful pride and ambition blinds us. When we are ambitious for what God has called us to do as men and women that is a great thing and blessed of God.  So when a young man has career ambitions and ambitions of not only having a family and providing for them but also making his mark on the world that is from God himself and it is good.  When a young woman has ambitions of marrying a godly man that can fully provide for her and her future children and she has ambitions for caring for those children and her home this again is from God and it pleases him.

But what about men that have ambitions to marry a woman who can provide for them as a man so they can care for the home and children? This ambition is a sinful one because it violates God’s design. What about a young man who has ambitions to marry a career woman knowing he will not be able to fully provide and knowing she will not be able to fully dedicate herself to their home as God wills? Again such an ambition is a sinful and selfish ambition.

Let me conclude with this warning to young couples who want to follow the path God has set forth in the Bible.

You have two choices in this life.  You are either called by God to a life of celibacy in his service or you are called to seek out marriage.  There are is no choice in between.  Now notice I said “seek out marriage” because not everyone will find someone to marry. But if we are not given the gift of celibacy, we are called to seek marriage.

To young men:

If you have not been given the call of God to celibacy in his service and you have a desire to seek out marriage then you cannot seek out a career path that will never be able to fully provide for your future family. If your future plans for marriage involve your future wife having to work to help provide then your future plans are WRONG. Perhaps the career path you are thinking about will eventually be able to provide for a family but at first it will not be able to.  Many men pursue apprenticeship jobs in fields that do not make enough to provide for a family but eventually they will. That is ok.  But then you must wait for marriage until your career plans come to fruition and you are able to provide for your wife and future children.

And finally to young men – not only should you be able to provide but you should seek out a Christian woman that wants a man that believes he should be able to provide for her. You want a woman that appreciates this conviction and your desire for yourself and your future wife to follow God’s design for men and women.

In other words – don’t marry a career woman. And you know how to NOT fall in love with and marry a career woman? Don’t date one.

To young women:

If you have not been given the call of God to celibacy in his service and you have a desire to seek out marriage then you must not seek out a career.  It is one thing to work and save money while you are seeking your future husband. In fact this could be a blessing to your future husband. But you must be able to drop whatever work it is you are doing the moment you find the man God has for you so that you can fully dedicate yourself to serving him in the role God has given you as his helper.

There is no sin in you as a young woman going to college while seeking that man that God has for you. But make sure that this will not saddle your husband with great debt.  So that might mean going to a community college where it is more affordable and you can work a part time job and pay off the schooling as you take it. If your parents can pay for a better school while you look than that is fine as well as long as you will not be passing this debt to your future husband.

Your goal whether you go to college or just work a job while looking for him is to come into the marriage with little or no debt or perhaps a small savings from your work that you can bless your husband with as you enter the marriage together.

Seek out a godly man that can also provide for you as God wants every man to do for his wife and children. This is not a matter of “either or” as if you must choose between finding a godly man or a man that can provide for you.  If the man you seek to marry truly understands God’s word and wants to live that out he will not want to marry you until he can provide.

I thank God for whomever anonymously paid for that message board. We will need more of those around our country to stir up this conversation and to help bring people back to the design that God has for men and women.

 

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19 thoughts on “Real men DO provide and Real women DO appreciate it

  1. Good article except for one thing which you didn’t directly mention or that didn’t seem to occur to you; God’s command to Eve that she would desire her husband wasn’t talking about that she would want to rule over him or have sinful desires regarding him as God would never have commanded such being a righteous God opposed to such things, and His statement to Eve was a command. Rather, this word in the Hebrew, which also points to sexual desire and is used to point to that not only here but in Song of Solomon, means that she would sexually desire her husband(going hand-in-hand with the previous statement about multiplying her pain and conception of childbirth) as well as pointing out she would commit to Adam wholeheartedly. Basically like “Your longing, your desire shall be for your husband(not to someone else, just him), you will commit to him wholeheartedly,” and not show more commitment to other things in the world, such as her kids or anything, than Eve would to her husband. Any sinful desires of women to rule over their husbands rather than submit are not part of God’s command to Eve here. Other than that, wonderful job! 🙂

  2. Great article. Yes, exactly. A career woman, a woman who works to satisfy her own personal gain and desires, rather than works to help her husband provide for her family is a snare.

    She may seem nice on the surface, but her heart is as cold as ice, and as hard as stone. She may be “nice” to her husband, but only because of the status she may gain from marrying him, for example, because of his material worldly success as a fellow careerist himself, which is sin in his part.

    Most career women marry careerist men, because they can use them to rise to a high position.

    Beware of career women at your workplace, especially those in management. I’m not talking about the ones who work to help provide for their families, in order to survive. No, I am talking about the ones who have often been divorced a few times, and typically adulterous, and who bullying, mean, proud, manipulative jezebels.

  3. Have a question!

    Is the woman supposed to be involved fully in the household for all her life or only till the children reach a certain age like for example their teens?

  4. Very nice. I especially liked the focus and good advice given towards young people. Who you get married to is one of the most important decisions in life as like good or bad friends, a good or bad spouse will steer you. Either towards growth and Godliness or against it. This article is great because it challenges the mistruth spread everyday in the world with biblical truth. If you are a man looking for a wife, find one who loves Jesus and will accept your leadership and the roles for husbands and wives laid out by the bible. If she says she loves Jesus, but isn’t willing to do what the bible says and follow/obey you as her husband, then you have to ask yourself how committed is she to following Him. If you are a woman looking for a husband, find a man who will keep a marriage covenant with you. Look deep into his heart to see how he operates when no one is around. Look for a man who wants to please the heart of God first and people second.

  5. Rohan,

    That is a great question and one I often get asked. The way we answer that question is with another question:

    Does God call women “to be involved fully in the household” simply for the sake of the children? The answer is no.

    We must dive deeper and ultimately ask “Why a woman is called by God to be the keeper of the home?” The answer is because God said so.

    Then this leads us to the most important question about women.

    Why did God make woman? The scriptures tell us the answer to this:

    “And the Lord God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.”
    Genesis 2:18 (KJV)

    “10 Who can find a virtuous woman? for her price is far above rubies.
    11 The heart of her husband doth safely trust in her, so that he shall have no need of spoil.
    12 She will do him good and not evil all the days of her life…
    27 She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness.”
    Proverbs 31:10-12 & 27(KJV)

    “Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.”
    1 Corinthians 11:9 (KJV)

    So the scriptures answer your question. Contrary to popular modern belief the most important reason a woman is to fully dedicate herself to her home is not because of her children but because God designed her to serve her husband by caring for the needs of his home so when he arrives home from his daily quests he has nothing to worry about. She has everything in order.

    Sadly many Christian women today have the attitude after their kids are grown and gone “He can take care of himself – he is grown man” in reference to their husband as if their caring for the home was only for children who needed help. This attitude is highly displeasing to God and misses a woman’s primary reason for being created which was for her husband.

    On the issue of teens – I can say from experience with teens that mothers are still needed to be fully available to the needs of their family during this time. There are all kinds of school events and other activities that require a mom taking kids around and dropping them off remember the group called “soccer moms”? I can tell you for those who had mothers still home during that time(as I did) we were very grateful for all our moms did for the family and so are the fathers.

    But what about when there is an empty nest? Once the kids are gone out of the house and off to college or married it will free up a lot of time on the part of the wife. If she wants to do some part time work or go back and get some education but she still keeps up with the affairs of the home for her husband I see no issue with that as long as the husband approves. She can also get more involved in women’s ministries of her church.

    But let’s not forget the grand kids. A great thing that many Christian mothers do is help their adult children by watching and caring for the grandchildren from time to time as needed and this is a great way for them to bond with their grand children. She also helps her daughters learn how to be mothers and shares her life experience with them.

  6. >gone “He can take care of himself – he is grown man”

    I wanted to expand upon the mistruth you brought up bgr. The world says in one breath that a man is a useless child who needs a woman to do everything for him because he is in capable, and on the other hand, he should be fully capable of taking care of himself without needing anything. BOTH ideas are wrong. A man _should be_ strong, upright, leading, capable, and able to travel along a Godly path while leading his family to do the same. At the same time, a man has been gifted or blessed with a wife to help him with these goals. So, he should be able capable, AND, though he may not need a wife’s help, it is the Lord’s blessing to him to have a wife to bless him.

  7. anonymous,

    I think you may have misunderstood that statement that I made. I am not saying a man should not be capable of doing things like picking up his own clothes, washing them, cooking and cleaning for himself or his family. Men should have these skills as well as they are life skills that every person should have. What I mean is that when women make the statement “He can take care of himself – he is grown man” what they are saying is BECAUSE he is capable of all these things they don’t need to do any of these things anymore.

    When women do this they are being a mother to their husband, rather than a wife.

    It is a good thing when mothers push their children to be more independent and do things for themselves as fathers should as well. I will admit this is still something I struggle with my teens on getting them to do things around the house more like laundry and other things. One of my older sons cooks decently enough and the other barely cooks and I push him to do it more as I believe it is a life skill he should have.

    But a woman must fully realize that the relationship between her and her husband is completely different than the one between her and her children. With her children – she was their authority and responsible for teaching them and training them. But her husband is HER authority. Not only is her authority but God made her for him to serve him as his helper.

    So that means while she may force her teen to go get his own dinner plate, or go clean his own dinner plate she does not do that to her husband. But instead in humility she asks him what he would like and gladly brings him a plate of food. If he forgets and leaves his plate on the table she happily takes his plate and cleans it off for him because he is the man God made her for. She washes his clothing for him not because he incapable of doing it – but because it is her pleasure and honor to do it. She recognizes that all these things around the house she does for him – she is doing for the Lord.

    That was my point.

  8. bgr – I didn’t misunderstand – I agree with you and am with you fully in both posts. You are spot on in this article and your posts here. I was just pointing out that comments like that that the world would make and accept are steeped in serious misunderstandings of how things should be.

  9. anonymous,

    Also why don’t come up with a more original name than ‘anonymous’. I have almost deleted your comments several times because I get a lot of spam and other garbage from people who call themselves ‘anonymous’. Any other code name will suffice. 🙂

  10. Tyler,
    Your Statement:

    “Good article except for one thing which you didn’t directly mention or that didn’t seem to occur to you; God’s command to Eve that she would desire her husband wasn’t talking about that she would want to rule over him or have sinful desires regarding him as God would never have commanded such being a righteous God opposed to such things, and His statement to Eve was a command…”

    Tyler – I disagree on your interpretation of this passage from Genesis. Like many other words in the Scriptures context matters. Also figure of speech matters. This is actually a Hebrew figure of speech that is used in another place not long after this in Genesis.

    “Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
    Genesis 3:16 (KJV)

    Notice in the very next chapter of Genesis God uses the exact same phrasing with Cain:

    “If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
    Genesis 4:7 (KJV)

    So we have the exact same phrase but only the object desiring and the one being desired have changed. While sin is not an actual person we know this is referring to Cain’s sinful man, his flesh which desires to control him and cause him to sin against God.

    I agree with you that God would not command someone to sin and that it was not part of his plan – it was a result of the fall in Eden. God did multiply the woman’s pain in child birth and he did make the ground harder for Adam to work. But if we look at this exact same Hebrew phrase which is used in the next chapter of Cain struggle with his sin nature we can see this was God predicting(not commanding) that Eve because of her new sinful nature(as Cain had) that she would desire to control her husband.

    So what is the formula we learn of this same phrase from Cain?

    The problem God sees is happening:

    “And unto thee shall be his[Sin nature, old man] desire”


    The solution God commands to this problem:

    “and thou shalt rule over him”

    Now lets apply the same formula to the problem God foresees that will happen between man and woman and man:

    The problem God sees is happening:

    “thy[woman’s sinful nature] desire shall be to thy husband”

    The solution God commands to this problem:

    “and he shall rule over thee”

    So it is for this reason that I stand by my interpretation of that passage.

  11. Hi BGR,
    Just started reading your blogs, and I love what you have to say…wished I had found you earlier….
    But if I could offer some constructive criticism here?
    You have conflated Genesis 3:16, and Genesis 4:7 and said they are saying the same thing, but they are definitely NOT saying the same thing!
    Genesis 3:16 has the phrase “thy desire’ which is a personal feminine verb, whereas Genesis 4:7 has the phrase “his desire’ which is a masculine pronoun denoting an OBJECT…..It’s tiny details like this that make ALL the difference when trying to understand crucial passages
    I personally believe you took these 2 verses, assumed they said the same thing, and built a doctrine around it
    I believe the woman’s “desire” here is none other than her physical, sexual, emotional need for a man, I don’t believe it refers to her fallen sinful nature at all

    Could you perhaps go into more detail with your understanding of these 2 passages please so I can understand you?

  12. cybersith1,

    Your Statement:

    “You have conflated Genesis 3:16, and Genesis 4:7 and said they are saying the same thing, but they are definitely NOT saying the same thing!
    Genesis 3:16 has the phrase “thy desire’ which is a personal feminine verb, whereas Genesis 4:7 has the phrase “his desire’ which is a masculine pronoun denoting an OBJECT…..It’s tiny details like this that make ALL the difference when trying to understand crucial passages”

    I realize the gender is different but it changes nothing in my opinion. The main point is what kind of desire is this? Whether a man, a woman or an object(such as sin) has desire to a person we must ask ourselves “what is this desire to do”?

    This Hebrew word here is T@shuwqah and is only used three times in the Old Testament:

    “Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire[T@shuwqah] shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.”
    Genesis 3:16

    “If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire[T@shuwqah] , and thou shalt rule over him”
    Genesis 4:7

    “I am my beloved’s, and his desire[T@shuwqah] is toward me.”
    Solomon 7:10 (KJV)

    So we can see that this Hebrew word for desire is used in two different places besides Genesis 3:16.

    In Genesis 4:7 it speaks of sin desiring to control Cain – but commanding that Cain should rule over his sin nature, not allow his nature to rule over him.

    Then this same word is used in the Song of Solomon speaking of the mutual sexual desire between a husband and wife.

    Now I realize the temptation is to run to its use in Song of Solomon and say it is speaking of a sexual desire. The problem is CONTEXT. the figure of speech is not the same and gender is irrelevant here. We can’t just assume because one has a female pronoun in front of it and the other has a male pronoun that this somehow changes the fact that the desire is a desire to control – not sexual desire.

    In Song of Solomon the structure is “one person has desire for another, and the other has desire for them”
    In Genesis 3:16 the structure is “one person has a desire for another and the other shall rule the person who has that desire toward them”.

    There are two reasons that I take the position that desire of woman spoken of by God toward her husband in Genesis 3:16 is a negative one.

    The first is that even without Genesis 4:7 for comparison we see God saying two things:
    The wife will desire something toward her husband, and then her husband will rule over her. It makes little sense if his reaction to her desire is to rule over her if her desire is a good one. In Song of Solomon her desire toward him makes him desire her. That makes sense.

    But then we see that Genesis 4:7 actually uses the same structure saying one would desire something toward another, but the other other would rule over the one having desire toward them that settles it for me.

    So that is why I take the position I do.

    Also I think the Bible in other passages further supports the idea that part of a woman’s sin nature is to control her husband:
    “A foolish son is the calamity of his father: and the contentions of a wife are a continual dropping.”
    Proverbs 19:13 (KJV)
    “It is better to dwell in the wilderness, than with a contentious and an angry woman.”
    Proverbs 21:19 (KJV)
    “A continual dropping in a very rainy day and a contentious woman are alike.”
    Proverbs 27:15 (KJV)

    Contention is a form of trying to control a situation to the outcome that one contending it would like it to be. Submission is the complete opposite of contention and that is what God calls for. So the original God given nature God gave woman before sin was a submissive one in keeping with his design for her toward Adam. But woman’s sin nature would seek to do the opposite, instead of submitting the man – it would seek to control the man.

  13. Hey much appreciated BGR for restoring my comment…..all forgiven 😊 mistakes happen
    I like your answer, and you won’t get no argument from me that a possible meaning of those verses are a woman’s selfish, manipulative desire to control her husband and by extension men in general
    Woman are completely out of control now in society and their primary way to control men is through their P…….y. ..I won’t say the word here in this blog but we all know what it means!
    We have an epidemic in the west of sexless marriages where men are lucky if they get it once a week let alone once a month
    Anyway I digress, I think you made a good valid point but I still hold (partially) to my position that the language and context signify a woman’s desire in this context is her sexual need for him EVEN THOUGH he will rule over her….this explains to me a woman’s almost like schizophrenic nature and I think it’s caused by this curse on Eve where women will simultaneously crave a man physically yet resent every aspect of male authority and try to undermine him every chance she gets
    Anyway that’s my thoughts
    I can’t wait to read all your other blogs in here. …you truly have some awesome stuff!

  14. Tell me if I’m mistaken, but it seems to me that it would be wise for a man to delay getting married until he is somewhere between the age of 26 and 34. This seems to be the time when most men (myself included) finally start getting their head on straight about money and their career. In my early 20s, I pursued a dead-end career, racked up student loans, then burned through what little income I had on get-rich-quick schemes. I got married when I was 21. The Lord was merciful and we’re at a better place now, but my youthful folly definitely caused some needless stress.

    If I were doing it over, I think I’d wait until I knew how to make money, then marry a woman under the age of 20 if possible. That way, she would have a wide window of fertility, we’d have no financial stress, and the age/maturity gap would make it much easier for her to submit.

    This seems to make sense to me. What do you think?

  15. Solomon77,

    I agree with what you said and Biblically it makes sense. While women should marry very young – men should wait a bit and establish themselves. The only thing I would add to what you said is that not only should they wait for marriage but they should also wait for dating. The whole “I will just date for fun for years and then get married later” thing is unbiblical as well. Not dating until a man is ready for marriage makes sense on a practical level as a man can be swayed easily by his sexual drive for a woman. He may give up his pursuit of a college career and his financial stability just to be with her earlier than he should be. This is why men must guard themselves from intimate contact with women of any kind until they are fully ready for marriage.

  16. “Not dating until a man is ready for marriage makes sense on a practical level as a man can be swayed easily by his sexual drive for a woman.”

    This is why your controversial teachings on porn use and masturbation are of such practical importance to young men. The primary reason I married at 21 was because I was trying to avoid the “sin” of masturbation and pornography.

    Six years into my marriage now and I’ve found your blog to be a great source of unexpected blessing. I’ve been able to re-frame the marriage. Even if my wife doesn’t yet submit to me in all areas, I feel more confident with who I am in Christ and know I’ll have the patience to be a real husband instead of just a “partner.”

    Looking forward to giving my children a better foundation to start their lives with. Keep up the good work 🙂

  17. Solomon77,

    Your Statement:

    “The primary reason I married at 21 was because I was trying to avoid the “sin” of masturbation and pornography.”

    The entire premise that a man cannot masturbate or have sexual fantasies of any kind and all this sexual energy must directed only at his wife in marriage is a false teaching that has lead many men to marry the wrong woman or marry too young. I have seen it so many times over the years with my Christian friends.

    Also this same premise gives a wife a power in marriage over her husband God never intended her to have. Think about it – if you cannot masturbate and all your sexual energy must be directed at sex with your wife she can control you. You have no way to exercise your sexual needs. Since men need sex far more often than women most of the time this puts a man in a position of having to capitulate to his wife and kiss her feet because she is his only sexual outlet.

    That is why I discuss polygamy a lot on this site. I believe among many other benefits of Biblically practiced polygamy that it takes away the woman’s power in the sexual area. If a man has many wives to have sex with – it is they that compete for his time and affection(as seen in Genesis 30:14-16), not him competing for their time and affection as our world shows men doing today as they gravel at their wife’s feet. But unfortunately at least at the present time polygamy is very difficult to practice in our modern culture for many reasons. So fantasy, as opposed to polygamy, has to be the tool a man uses to free himself from the grip of his wife if she is a sexually controlling woman(I have a post in my stack of stuff I have been working on regarding sexually controlling wives and that is coming soon.)

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